About
"That was the boutique aspect of MTM. There was nothing we HAD to do because we had thousands of people on the payroll. We just did the things that appealed to us, some of which didn't appeal to others, so they became failed pilots or whatever."
In his five-hour interview, legendary television executive Grant Tinker (1926-2016) describes his first encounter with NBC, as one of the company's first interns back in 1949, and recounts his work as part of NBC radio. He comments on his move to advertising agencies McCann-Erickson and Benton & Bowles, where he served as an executive working with television programs. Tinker recalls his involvement with The Danny Thomas Show and The Dick Van Dyke Show, among others, and discusses working with Sheldon Leonard. He talks of meeting Mary Tyler Moore, whom he would later marry, and outlines co-founding MTM Enterprises, a successful production company known for the critically acclaimed programs The Mary Tyler Moore Show, The Bob Newhart Show, Lou Grant, The White Shadow, Hill Street Blues, and St. Elsewhere. He also discusses his return to and rise at NBC television, to the position of chairman and CEO, and shares a bit of trivia about the NBC chimes. Morrie Gelman conducted the interview on April 8, 1998 in Bel Air, CA.
Highlights
Grant Tinker on the creation of MTM
Grant Tinker on the development and sponsorship of The Dick Van Dyke Show
Grant Tinker on creating the environment of MTM
Grant Tinker on the NBC chimes
Grant Tinker on his soothing effect on colleagues at NBC and "first be best, then be first"
Grant Tinker on his affinity for multi-camera shows
Full Interview
Chapter 1
On his early years and education; on growing up during the Great Depression; on how his mother being deaf impacted him; on loving books and listening to the radio; on Darthmouth and the Air Corps; on wanting to work in publishing after graduation
On his start in broadcasting at NBC radio as the first trainee; on working at Radio Free Europe; on returning to the U.S. and heading West; on meeting Allen Ludden and creating College Quiz Bowl for radio; on starting in television
Chapter 2
On working in radio and developing New Talent USA; on leaving radio to become Vice President of Program Development at McCann Erickson; on agencies' involvement in television series; on Revlon and the Quiz Show Scandals; on working for ad agency Warwick & Legler; on Charles Revson of Revlon
On working for Benton & Bowles advertising; on the development and sponsorship of The Dick Van Dyke Show; on his divorce from his first wife and his second marriage to Mary Tyler Moore; on heading West Coast Programming at NBC
Chapter 3
On how the Quiz Show Scandals changed the relationship between advertising agencies and television shows; on shared advertising on The Dick Van Dyke Show; on ad agencies breeding future television executives; on his relationships with multiple television shows while at Benton & Bowles advertising agency
On Mort Werner bringing Tinker back to NBC after his time at Benton & Bowles; on NBC and shows he was associated with in the 1960s; on David Wolper's contributions to syndication
Chapter 4
On his colleagues at NBC; on how NBC got Get Smart; on turning down Bewitched for NBC; on the MCA-Universal-NBC link; on developing movies for television
On NBC's The Name of the Game; on his allegiance to The Dick Van Dyke Show; on the TV business landscape at the time of The Dick Van Dyke Show; on his transfer to New York and breaking his contract to return to California; on working for Universal
Chapter 5
On leaving Universal and working for William Self, head of 20th Century Fox Television; on the creation of MTM and the development of The Mary Tyler Moore Show
On casting The Mary Tyler Moore Show; on fighting Mike Dann to get The Mary Tyler Moore Show on the air; on the pilot testing poorly; on CBS and NBC executives and Paul Klein's least objectionable programming
Chapter 6
On establishing MTM Productions; on network executives he worked with while he was at MTM - Bob Wood, Mike Dann and Fred Silverman; on The Mary Tyler Moore Show garnering numerous Emmys and the end of the series
On Lou Grant and its cancellation after four years; on Steven Bochco and Bruce Paltrow; on MTM being known for comedies during its early years
Chapter 7
On running MTM Productions with his staff: Arthur Price, Stu Irwin and Mel Blumenthal; on the end of his marriage to Mary Tyler Moore, but continued friendship with her; on returning to NBC in 1981 and his regrets about leaving MTM; on working with Brandon Tartikoff; on the shows that saved NBC
On 1983's record number of Emmy nominations for NBC; on his controversy with TV Guide; on speaking at Harvard University; on firing Howard Stern; on his confrontation with Judd Hirsch at the Emmys; on his Chairman's council; on his soothing effect on colleagues at NBC and "first be best, then be first"
Chapter 8
On his team that resuscitated NBC; on leaving NBC in September 1986 to return to TV production on the West Coast, just as GE bought RCA; on Jack Welch naming Bob Wright President of NBC; on his theory on broadcasting
On life after leaving NBC and how the economy of the business had changed; on GTG and GNET; on making a deal with CBS; on his shows WILU and TV 101; on industry affairs and ageism
On the key to programming success; on the future of commercial networks
Chapter 9
On the future of independent production companies; on advertising; on cable and the 500-channel universe; on the role of network executives; on his time at MTM
On some of the individuals he has worked with over the years; on "Hill Street Station"
Chapter 10
On some of the individuals he's worked with during his career; on the three wonderful women that have been a part of his life
Shows
90 Bristol Court
Grant Tinker on NBC's 90 Bristol Court
Andy Williams Show, The
Grant Tinker on representing The Andy Williams Show while at Benton & Bowles
Bewitched
Grant Tinker on turning down Bewitched for NBC
Bob Newhart Show, The (1972-78)
Grant Tinker on the creation of The Bob Newhart Show at MTM
Cheers
Grant Tinker on Les Charles and Glen Charles - creators of Cheers
Dean Martin Show, The
Grant Tinker on Greg Garrison producing The Dean Martin Show
Dick Van Dyke Show, The
Grant Tinker on the development and sponsorship of The Dick Van Dyke Show
Grant Tinker on CBS' James T. Aubrey canceling The Dick Van Dyke Show after its first season and Sheldon Leonard's reaction
Grant Tinker on Mary Tyler Moore getting cast on The Dick Van Dyke Show and shared advertising on the show
Grant Tinker on his allegiance to The Dick Van Dyke Show
Emmy Awards, The (Primetime and Daytime)
Grant Tinker on his confrontation with Judd Hirsch at the Emmys
Get Smart
Grant Tinker on how NBC got Get Smart
Hill Street Blues
Grant Tinker on Hill Street Blues
I Spy
Grant Tinker on Sheldon Leonard wanting to do I Spy
Lou Grant
Grant Tinker on MTM's Lou Grant
Mary Tyler Moore Show, The
Grant Tinker on the creation of The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Grant Tinker on the development of The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Grant Tinker on The Mary Tyler Moore Show garnering numerous Emmys (29 total); on the end of the series
Name of the Game, The
Grant Tinker on NBC's The Name of the Game
Paris
Grant Tinker on Bruce Paltrow and Steven Bochco's shows before MTM's successes
Room 222
Grant Tinker on meeting James L. Brooks and Allan Burns via leaving Universal for Fox
Taxi
Grant Tinker on his confrontation with Judd Hirsch at the Emmys
White Shadow, The
Grant Tinker on the success of MTM's The White Shadow
Topics
Advertising and Sponsorship
Grant Tinker on the development and sponsorship of The Dick Van Dyke Show
Emmy Awards
Grant Tinker on The Mary Tyler Moore Show garnering numerous Emmys (29 total) - the most for one show, ever
Grant Tinker on his confrontation with Judd Hirsch at the Emmys
Historic Events and Social Change
Grant Tinker on diversity on television in the 1960s
Grant Tinker on the lack of diversity in television
Industry Crossroads
Grant Tinker on Revlon and the Quiz Show Scandals
Grant Tinker on how the Quiz Show Scandals changed the relationship between advertising agencies and television shows
Media Consolidation
Grant Tinker on Jack Welch buying RCA
Quiz Show Scandals
Grant Tinker on Revlon and the Quiz Show Scandals
Grant Tinker on how the Quiz Show Scandals changed the relationship between advertising agencies and television shows
Representation on Television
Grant Tinker on diversity on television in the 1960s
Grant Tinker on the lack of diversity in television
Technological Innovation
Grant Tinker on NBC moving to color television
Television Industry
Grant Tinker on Revlon and the Quiz Show Scandals
Grant Tinker on how the Quiz Show Scandals changed the relationship between advertising agencies and television shows
Grant Tinker on Jack Welch buying RCA
Underrepresented Voices
Grant Tinker on diversity on television in the 1960s
Grant Tinker on the lack of diversity in television
Women
Grant Tinker on the lack of diversity in television
Professions
Executives
Grant Tinker on ad agencies breeding future television executives
Grant Tinker on leaving MTM to become Chairman of NBC
Grant Tinker on his theory on broadcasting
Producers
Grant Tinker on the creation of MTM
Television Executive
Grant Tinker on ad agencies breeding future television executives
Grant Tinker on leaving MTM to become Chairman of NBC
Grant Tinker on his theory on broadcasting
Genres
Comedy Series
Grant Tinker on the development and sponsorship of The Dick Van Dyke Show
Grant Tinker on CBS' James T. Aubrey canceling The Dick Van Dyke Show after its first season and Sheldon Leonard's reaction
Grant Tinker on how NBC got Get Smart
Grant Tinker on the development of The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Grant Tinker on Les Charles and Glen Charles - creators of Cheers
Drama Series
Grant Tinker on Lou Grant
Grant Tinker on Hill Street Blues
People
Don Adams
Grant Tinker on how NBC got Get Smart
David Adams
Grant Tinker on NBC's David Adams
Edward Asner
Grant Tinker on casting The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Grant Tinker on Lou Grant's Ed Asner
Grant Tinker on Ed Asner
James T. Aubrey
Grant Tinker on CBS' James T. Aubrey canceling The Dick Van Dyke Show after its first season, and Sheldon Leonard's reaction
Joan Bennett
Grant Tinker on MCA's head of television, Jennings Lang
Steven Bochco
Grant Tinker on Steven Bochco
Grant Tinker on Steven Bochco
Mel Brooks
Grant Tinker on how NBC got Get Smart
James L. Brooks
Grant Tinker on the development of The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Charlotte Brown
Grant Tinker on writer Charlotte Brown
Allan Burns
Grant Tinker on the development of The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Robert Butler
Grant Tinker on Robert Butler, the director of the Hill Street Bluespilot who was crucial to the show's success
Glenn Gordon Caron
Grant Tinker on Glenn Gordon Caron
Marcy Carsey
Grant Tinker on the success of Carsey Werner productions
Glen Charles
Grant Tinker on Les Charles and Glen Charles
Les Charles
Grant Tinker on Les Charles and Glen Charles
Dan Curtis
Grant Tinker on Dan Curtis
Stan Daniels
Grant Tinker on Stan Daniels
Michael Dann
Grant Tinker on paying tribute to Mort Werner
Grant Tinker on Mike Dann's reaction to The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Grant Tinker on CBS executive Mike Dann
Dave Davis
Grant Tinker on MTM staff - Dave Davis
Bob Elliott
Grant Tinker on working for Bob and Ray's agent, John Moses
Norman Felton
Grant Tinker on Norman Felton bringing shows from MGM
Grant Tinker on Norman Felton
Bob Finkel
Grant Tinker on producer Bob Finkel
Greg Garrison
Grant Tinker on Greg Garrison producing The Dean Martin Show
Gary David Goldberg
Grant Tinker on Gary David Goldberg
Leonard H. Goldenson
Grant Tinker on Leonard Goldenson's part in the industry moving West
Grant Tinker on Leonard H. Goldenson
Julian Goodman
Grant Tinker on mixed feelings Julian Goodman, former NBC News President
Ray Goulding
Grant Tinker on working for Bob and Ray's agent, John Moses
Lawrence K. Grossman
Grant Tinker on Larry Grossman, former NBC News President
Valerie Harper
Grant Tinker on casting The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Grant Tinker on the family setting of The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Grant Tinker on Valerie Harper
Buck Henry
Grant Tinker on how NBC got Get Smart
Judd Hirsch
Grant Tinker on his confrontation with Judd Hirsch at the Emmys
Paul King
Grant Tinker on Paul King
Robert E. Kintner
Grant Tinker on turning down Bewitched for NBC
Paul L. Klein
Grant Tinker on NBC executive Paul Klein and lowest objectionable programming
Ted Knight
Grant Tinker on the family setting of The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Michael Kozoll
Grant Tinker on Michael Kozoll
Jennings Lang
Grant Tinker on MCA's head of television, Jennings Lang, inventor of movies for television
Grant Tinker on running into Jennings Lang and going to work for Universal
Bill Lawrence
Grant Tinker on the success of Bill Lawrence
Cloris Leachman
Grant Tinker on the family setting of The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Sheldon Leonard
Grant Tinker on the development and sponsorship of The Dick Van Dyke Show
Grant Tinker on CBS' James T. Aubrey canceling The Dick Van Dyke Show after its first season and Sheldon Leonard's reaction
Grant Tinker on first meeting Sheldon Leonard; on casting Mary Tyler Moore in The Dick Van Dyke Show
Grant Tinker on Sheldon Leonard wanting to do I Spy
Allen Ludden
Grant Tinker on meeting Allen Ludden and creating College Quiz Bowl for radio
Grant Tinker on friend and colleague Allen Ludden
John Mitchell
Grant Tinker on turning down Bewitched for NBC; on his friendship with John Mitchell
Mary Tyler Moore
Grant Tinker on the development and sponsorship of The Dick Van Dyke Show
Grant Tinker on Mary Tyler Moore getting cast on The Dick Van Dyke Show
Grant Tinker on the development of The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Grant Tinker on the family setting of The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Grant Tinker on stars wanting to work within the environment of MTM
Grant Tinker on the end of his marriage to Mary Tyler Moore, but continued friendship with her
John Moses
Grant Tinker on agent John Moses
Lorenzo Music
Grant Tinker on Lorenzo Music
Bob Newhart
Grant Tinker on stars wanting to work within the environment of MTM
William S. Paley
Grant Tinker on CBS founder Bill Paley
Bruce Paltrow
Grant Tinker on Bruce Paltrow
Tom Patchett
Grant Tinker on Tom Patchett and Jay Tarses
Arthur Price
Grant Tinker on his number two at MTM Enterprises, Arthur Price
Carl Reiner
Grant Tinker on the development and sponsorship of The Dick Van Dyke Show
Charles Revson
Grant Tinker on meetings with Charles Revson of Revlon
Gene Reynolds
Grant Tinker on Lou Grant producer Gene Reynolds
Lee Rich
Grant Tinker on meeting Lee Rich at Benton & Bowles and supervising shows
Grant Tinker on Lee Rich fighting networks
Grant Tinker on paying tribute to Mort Werner
Grant Tinker on paying tribute to Mort Werner
Jay Sandrich
Grant Tinker on casting and crewing up for The Mary Tyler Moore Show
Robert Sarnoff
Grant Tinker on Robert Sarnoff
Thomas W. Sarnoff
Grant Tinker on Lew Wasserman's deal with Thomas Sarnoff at NBC
Grant Tinker on Tom Sarnoff
Herbert S. Schlosser
Grant Tinker on working with Herb Schlosser at NBC
Irwin Segelstein
Grant Tinker on meeting Irwin Segelstein at Benton & Bowles and supervising shows
Grant Tinker on Irwin Segelstein
William Self
Grant Tinker on working for William Self, head of 20th Century Fox Television
Sid Sheinberg
Grant Tinker on MCA's lawyer, Sid Sheinberg
Fred Silverman
Grant Tinker on CBS executive Fred Silverman
Grant Tinker on CBS executive Fred Silverman
Grant Tinker on NBC executives Brandon Tartikoff and Fred Silverman
Frank Stanton
Grant Tinker on CBS executive Frank Stanton
Jules Stein
Grant Tinker on Jules Stein and Lew Wasserman
Howard Stern
Grant Tinker on firing Howard Stern
Jay Tarses
Grant Tinker on Tom Patchett and Jay Tarses
Brandon Tartikoff
Grant Tinker on NBC executive and friend, Brandon Tartikoff
Danny Thomas
Grant Tinker on the development and sponsorship of The Dick Van Dyke Show
Grant Tinker on Mary Tyler Moore getting cast on The Dick Van Dyke Show
Ray Timothy
Grant Tinker on Ray Timothy
Dick Van Dyke
Grant Tinker on the development and sponsorship of The Dick Van Dyke Show
Lew Wasserman
Grant Tinker on Lew Wasserman giving up MCA and keeping Universal Studios
Grant Tinker on Jules Stein and Lew Wasserman
Sylvester L. "Pat" Weaver
Grant Tinker on paying tribute to Mort Werner
Grant Tinker on Pat Weaver
Ed. Weinberger
Grant Tinker on Ed. Weinberger
Jack Welch
Grant Tinker on Jack Welch buying RCA
Mort Werner
Grant Tinker on Mort Werner bringing him back to NBC after Benton & Bowles; on Werner's death; on his role at NBC
Grant Tinker on how NBC got Get Smart
Tom Werner
Grant Tinker on the success of Carsey Werner productions
Ethel Winant
Grant Tinker on casting agent Ethel Winant
David L. Wolper
Grant Tinker on David Wolper's contributions to syndication
Robert D. Wood
Grant Tinker on CBS executive Robert D. Wood canceling the rural comedies on CBS to take on what would become historically important shows
Grant Tinker on executives he worked with while he was at MTM
Bob Wright
Grant Tinker on Jack Welch's decision to make Bob Wright President of NBC after Tinker's departure